Quail cross breeds....

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Quail cross breeds....

Post by xxangexx on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:00 am

After having coffee with my non quail owning mates, something got me thinking....

Can you get cross breed quails??
You know like a chinese x jap.

You can get cross breed dogs, and rabbits and even chickens (ok they're hybirds but same sort of thing) but I wasn't sure on quails.

It can up as someone said about keeping 2 different types in cage avairy, would think cross breed.

ange xx

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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by Ronnie's Quails on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:07 am

erm im not sure if you can because if noticed my CPQ stay together in a group and ive heard that people over this forums have groups of CPQ japs and bowhites that have theyre own little gang like on a playground like clicks.
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by Suz on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:35 am

There has been hybrids with bobwhites, the valleys & mountain quail. I know someone in America who has just hatched chicks from a Gambel mum & Mountain dad but he thinks the offspring will be mules (sterile)

But i can find no information on coturnix hybrids.

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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by adamntitch on Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:07 am

av kept japs and cpq together and never noticed any mating or courtship they keep them selfs to them selfs

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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Sat Jun 07, 2008 8:52 am

Hybridisation is more common in plants. Animals hybrids are usually genetic dead ends and a novelty. My favourite is a zonkey (zebra-donkey).

I'm sure it is possible. It happens in nature when isolated species are suddely put together. There is usually a biological, genetic, behavioural or even physical barrier to overcome (hence GM and various lab techniques). However, many claims of animal hybridisation tend to be hoaxes... specially on eBay! Evil or Very Mad
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by Ironsun on Sat Jun 07, 2008 11:37 am

Hi,

Firstly I would like to point out to you is, a bulldog X staff Terrier is not a Hybrid, it's still a dog as the parents are dogs (Same species) same as two different breeds of rabbits or chicken)

The cross of two different species produces hybrids.

To produce hybrids, the parent birds need to be very closly related as a species, you'll not get anything from a cow and a horse.
I don't think the japanese and chinese painted quails are that closly related so I very much doubt they'll every produce fertile eggs. If they were possably to fertilize an egg, and it hatch, the chick will probably be sterile.

Derek.
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:30 pm

I wiki-ed for known gamebird hybrids and found a few surprises (for me at least), but no notes of any quail hybrids. I don't know how accurate this wiki is;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamebird_hybrids

I was surprised that there have been interfamilial hybrids with guinea fowl. Though they probably produced in excess of a thousand eggs for each hybrid. Ususally when 2 species hybridise regularly there is question on whether they should be classified as separate species.
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by Suz on Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:49 pm

This is brilliant book if you can get hold of it 'Handbook of Avian Hybrids of the world' it list all the known quail hybrids. In there I found referance to coturnix sp x perdix perdix hybrids (grey partridge I think)

This is a Callipepla & Oreortyx hybrid (valley x mountain) -


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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:11 pm

Wow, that is a funky looking bird. Wonder if that is still alive?

There is also the danger that hybrid animals, which can sometime be quite vigorous, are released in the wild were they wouldn't otherwise exist. I've heard that crocodile farms have bred hybrid crocodiles that have escaped and interbred with indigeous population in SE Asia.
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by Bronze on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:26 pm

andoy wrote:Hybridisation is more common in plants. Animals hybrids are usually genetic dead ends and a novelty. My favourite is a zonkey (zebra-donkey).


See I know them as zebronkeys as my hubby calls me bronkey. I have a picture of one as my avatar on a few sites
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:43 pm

Let me guess, it says something like; "this is what happens when you fool around" ROFLMAO
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by arsenalno9 on Sat Jun 07, 2008 3:48 pm

I have just put my Californiain ( sunny babe sunny ) hen, in with all my spare Jap males........................................................"We will see," said the Bishop to the actress!? affraid
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by dave. on Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:04 pm

DEATH IS AROUND THE CORNER affraid Dave.
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:52 pm

how about a few fancy feathers, some superglue and a bit of imagination. Make your own; Pea-quail, quail-of-paradise and cuck-a-quail. Instant results and less hassle! Razz

How about a fancy dress quail party competition? Please post some pics in the gallery section. ROFLMAO
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:34 am

ironsun wrote "I dont think the japanese and chinese painted quails are that closely related"
I'm not sure thats accurate, as they belong to the same genus. Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:15 am

South American macaws are in the genus ara, not only are they commonly hybridised they are indeed fertile. As are the many conure hybrids. Perhaps the problems in hybridising japonica and chinensis, lie more in the direction of size difference. Also take into consideration that most people dont keep a lone chinensis with a lone japonica. I have read one account (on a site that has unfortunately changed hands) of someone keeping a japonica hen with a chinensis rooster, the two did succesfully mate. Again unfortunately, the author disbanded her flock and apparently never tried to incubate the possible hybrid eggs. Even if she had, theres still the question of hybrid fertility. If the number of chromosones does not match (horse 64, zebra between 44 and 62 depending on species) the offspring are invaribly infertile. Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:01 am

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov.pubmed/12642645This question got me thinking so much I went a bit google happy. And found something, not sure how much of it I understand but I think that it says that japonica and chinensis are very closely related indeed. Also I have emailed a professor at a&m university to ask him how many chromosomes each have, (japs have 78 ) he may know, as a&m is were the a&m white quail were developed. Its all very thought provoking, however I'm not sure I'd want to try it. Will post more info as I get it, Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:24 pm

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12642645Sorry lol! I think that link is dodgey try again? Ed


Last edited by QuailCrazyUSA on Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:26 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : links are not my specialty?)
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:42 pm

Hate to beat this one to death, but I didnt realize the link wasnt correct here are the pertinent (in my opinion) passages:
The blue-breasted quail mtDNA was found to be a circular DNA of 16,687 base pairs (bp) with the same genomic structure as the mtDNAs of Japanese quail... Sequence analysis revealed that the JQ (japanese quail) mitochondrial genome is a circular DNA of 16 697 basepairs (bp)... The sequence identity of all mitochondrial genes, including those for 12S and 16S ribosomal RNAs, between blue-breasted quail and Japanese quail ranged from 84.5% to 93.5%... This info was gleaned from two different articles, The jap article can be found in a side bar (top right) in the link I have already posted. This is doubly interesting to me due to a coincidental pairing of a jap hen (brown split to ginger and golden) with a white cpq roo. This pairing was not intentional, it only came about because of a recent failed hatching of jap and cpq eggs. I am still undecided wether or not I will try to incubate eggs from this pair. If I do and there are offspring, and they are fertile, will I sell them? Will the buyer be as honest as I am when he/she sells the eggs/offspring of these hybrids? As both species are bred in the hundreds of thousands all over the world, and seem to have a very strong gene pool, I doubt that any hybrids would have a serious impact on captive populations. Thus the ethical questions are of a personal nature. Regardless of the likelyhood or nature of offspring from this pair, it is funny and endearing at the same time to see the obvious pair bond between Belle and her little Snowflake. Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Tue Aug 12, 2008 10:54 pm

If they don't want to do the business, why not try artificial insemination? Or rub them together Razz

Good luck and don't forget to post the pics of any chicks Wink
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by internet_nobody on Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:14 pm

Mitochondrial DNA isn't as important as actual DNA of the birds though surely?
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:27 am

Very funny Andy Razz you stinker lolol! No rubbing them together or AI lol! If they do they do, if they dont at least they are happy together. And I'm not entirely sure Emma, as I stated in an earlier post I'm not sure I understand it completely. It just seemed to me to be suggestive of a close genetic relationship. It's all just food for thought really, as I'm not a mad scientist affraid lol! I just love them very much and cant bear to seperate them as I dont have a suitable mate for either. I myself am in a mixed race relationship, (my bf is black I'm white) how can I judge? Razz I must admit tho I very probably will incubate and candle the eggs from this pair out of curiosity. And yes Andy you handsome devil Twisted Evil I will post pics if there are any offspring. Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:49 am

While taking pics of Belle and Snowflake I began to wonder if Belle is a hen Embarassed or not. They are both around 4 weeks, Snowflake is the only one crowing. I have tried to vent sex them, and everything seems to be in order, but I'm a rank novice at the whole sexing thing. Can anyone tell me if I'm right about Belle's Gender? Bear in mind this bird is split to ginger and golden and may be a bit more ruddy in color because of that, hence my confusion! Embarassed Thanks in advance, Ed http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=7&u=12830744 http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=6&u=12830744
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by QuailCrazyUSA on Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:41 am

I guess Belle will have to have a name change, a roo for sure I just found out. Ah well at least he and snowflake get along. Perhaps I should name the brown jap after the OH and re-name snowflake after me? Razz ROFLMAO Ed
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Re: Quail cross breeds....

Post by andoy on Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:35 am

I was half serious about rubbing them together or swab the male to female,
but I don't think you'll get very far with 2 gay quails
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